What is your take on Tony Blair overuling the Catholic Church on Gay Adoption?

My own feeling is that for once, I wholeheartedly agree with Blair geeting bolshy! Why deny a child a good home just because some choose to believe gay = sinful? If they want to believe it sinful then fine but why should that unpopular, out of tune belief have a direct effect on a childs welfare and future? What's more annoying is that the Catholic Church get paid by Government to provide childcare services so why should they dictate the terms? Especially as they have such a squeaky clean reputation on the child mistreatment issues themselves, (NOT!).
I happen to believe, as I hope many more do, that Homosexuality is not wrong, not a sin and nor does it need to be discriminated agaisnt, it is normal but different, period. Discriminating agaisnt gay people is every bit as wrong as racial discrimination and we need to tolerate not one ounce of it. What is your take people?

I did Grinning Ape but you seem not to want to give it, so if you want to waste your time and pretend your funny, your choice.

Lets see people talk about cathlolic adoption agencies closing down... Good heres a typical one... all read and also look at what else the church is into

'The Magdelen Sisterss' should be in your video shop but the tv drama 'sinners' was more accurate if you can find it.
over 30,000 were involved up till 1996...how old were you at that time?
How many of your friends, you or your sister could have ended up here.

http://www.thewildgeese.com/pages/magdal...

http://www.netreach.net/~steed/magdalen....

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0380703/

http://www.bbc.co.uk/northernireland/dra...
Origonal documentry available from

http://cgi.ebay.com/SEX-IN-A-COLD-CLIMAT...

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/programmes/pa...

http://www.bbc.co.uk/pressoffice/pressre...

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/programmes/pa...

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/programmes/pa...

church support for child rape

http://www.thisislondon.co.uk/news/artic...

http://observer.guardian.co.uk/internati...

http://observer.guardian.co.uk/internati...

Vatican support for mass murders who like raping women with dogs

http://www.guardian.co.uk/print/0,,38097...

http://www.remember-chile.org.uk/comment...

http://select.nytimes.com/gst/abstract.h...



Now what have peadophiles ie sexaul bullies of children

have to do with gays.

guys who fancy guys, , often creative and funny

have in common?


Oh and how many husbands go the missus up the shitter or get it in return with a strap on?

I thought you wanted my take?

Unexpected but very much welcome! Good on Tony for this brave stand against the church, for once, he has done the right thing.

My take: Who cares. Let them do what they want

The Catholic Church and all others are obsolete.

I just find it very interesting that an organisation that has completely covered up its own role in various child abuse scandals should have a problem with homsexuals taking care of children. Surely the children are safer with homosexuals than Catholics!

i dunno.

Labour party going mad again, interfering with peoples rights, is it a party line ?

i agree with everything you said.

a close lesbian friend feels quite strongly about this, though she'd only ever enter a church to go to someone else's wedding.

But personally i would have understood if Blair had let them have their way. I'm an atheist now, but I have seen religion from the inside, and I know how they feel. They would have been wrong, but they're wrong about lots of things and it's a fool who thinks he can bring them out of that by legislation.

Contraception, on the other hand: now that's one I would get upset about. How dare religious leaders condemn millions to poverty by denying them birth control. That's a more damaging sin, in practical terms, horrible though prejudice is.

In one hand I feel it is not right to bring children up with gays, but I also think it is wrong to allow anybody to be excused from a law because of religion.

I couldn't agree with you more,discrimination of any kind is wrong and people that chose to drone on about religion and sins and other things that have nothing to do with a childs happiness should be ignored. An adopted child needs security,love and two adults that can look after and nurture it. There are so many disfunctional straight couples that have children and mistreat them, so why say a gay couple won't do a good job of it. The church is being selfish and unfair and simply worrying about themselves and their out of date morals and they are not worried about the issue, which is a child being put into a loving and secure family unit.

Homosexuality is NOT wrong but adoption...hmmm......it's the kids i feel sorry for, how embarrassing for them!!! Sorry but you did ask...This is a long topic, too long for my hour to get into this debate.

if we were to follow the bible then we would have to kill all the gay people.

And quite the most ridiculous thing that everyone's missed is that Catholic Adoption agencies tend to place kids with Catholics. Catholics who want to adopt, go to Catholic agencies. See many gay Catholic couples out there wanting to adopt? No. They're dealing completely in hypotheticals.

If the majority of the country have to put up with sick legislation, why should the Catholic Church be exempt?

Wellaner. What are these rights that the government is interfering with?

The right to behave in a discriminatory manner?
The right of an adoption agency to make a decision based not on the welfare of the child, but on some redundant doctrinal point?

I suppose you object to laws against theft on the grounds that they threaten a burglar's 'right' to make a living.

Penny! It's only embarrassing for a child to be adopted by a gay couple if we stigmatise it and allow it to be presented as abnormal, rather than different.

i HAVE TO AGREE-it is worse than Racial descrimination-----none of it is any good. as long as someone can care for a kid who cares or should care if it is two males or two females or male/female.

It is about time that religion's are not given exception's to the law as they have had for century's To my way of thinking religion as cuased more trouble over the century's than any one or thing

I think he did right.

The thing is this country is run under secular law. You can beleive what you want but you don't get any exception from the law because of your beleifs.

Are we going to say that would be Islamic Suicide Bombers should be exempt from the law against murder because they say their faith compels them to commit suicide attacks?!?!?

Whilst I very much doubt that any gay couple would approach the Catholic Church to try to adopt anyway, I don't see why anyone should have special allowances made under the law because of their beleifs. The law becomes unworkable otherwise.

Im not the Catholic Church's biggest fan but I have to admit im gonna side with them on this one.

The PC stazi are at it again and we are not allowed to discriminate or "offend" in anyway. If the catholics don't want gay people to adopt kids in their care than that is their choice as much as it is the couple's choice to adopt in the first place. There are plenty of other adoption agencies out there.

Also do you really think a homosexual couple wishing to adopt are going to make the Catholic church their first stop?

Contrary to popular belief I do believe that homosexuality is wrong, in the same way that peodophilia is wrong.
It may well be that both groups are unable to change their instincts, that does not mean that their instincts have to be obeyed. It is the actual obeyance of their instinct that is wrong.
That being the case it seems to me that gays have been given the right to insist that their beliefs and practices overrule those of other opposite-minded people, this cannot be right in a civilised so-called democracy.
It is also incorrect to say that the government have a right to pass this legislation, they never put any of these plans in their election manifesto and they can hardly claim that this is an urgent issue that came up without warning.
I wonder how many years hence will we see a child, who has been brought up in a gay household, suing the government because he was denied the chance to be brought up by a heterosexual couple and thus suuffered intolerable bullying etc at school and elsewhere.

Gay sex is abnormal no matter what you think! if god wanted gays why did he only produce two sexes ?? why not three? your anus was meant for unloading waste not getting sexual satisfaction and Blair has already ruined and shamed this country what the Roman Catholic Church does is none of his bloody business

i agree. if someone is going to take care of these kids, we should let them instead of having them trapped in the adoption system.
The only problem would be with the kids when they grow up and the potential problems they might face from other kids.
Otherwise i say go for it

Here we go again. Even more Politically Correct drivel, being spouted out by the protestant section of our society.

''I know, where not happy with this so we'll change it''

That is not how a religion is practiced. But just like King Henry VIII did all those centuries ago, protestants are still changing the goalposts to suit themselves.

At least Catholics can trace their religion back, unlike Prods, who can trace it back to a fat womanising half-wit monarch.

I find it extraordinary that an organisation that has actively protected sexually abusing priests moving them from parish to parish IN ORDER to conceal their sexual offences AND in the certain knowledge that MORE Catholic children would be placed at risk of sexual abuse, let alone the persecution they have subjected the brave people who have come forward....
is not an organisation that should have responsibility for children until they have shown rather more contrition that they have done hiothertofore. The Catholic Church needs to do a bit more repentance before we let them any where near children , particularly vulnerable children. The idea that they have anything to say after such abuse to anyo of use about morality beggars belief let alone sexual morality or maybe they haven't heard of that guy Jesus: "He who has no sin, cast the first stone...."?

Whenever the Cardinal comes on the TV or Radio I feel rather sick....could it be the whiff of hypocrisy?

steeling the word Gay dos justify a no no if people want to live that way that's called free will, but there are consequences and you can't get away from that neither can others you involve willingly or other wise. that includes children you will have to account for such things weather you believe in God or not because he believes in you. yours in J. C. p.w.l.

It's sad to think how desperate the situation is if we cant find normal family homes to adopt these children. Maybe if young couples didn't both have to work to pay their sky high mortgages, Mr Blair, things could be different as even they're not having children of their own as it was years ago. The church is correct, Blair never gets anything right.

How come you only want answers that agree with your views.everyone as their own views on any subject that you might ask,. You should have asked everybody who thinks gays should be able to adopt sign here. and sorry but I think it`s wrong ,A child needs both a mother and a father to have a balanced up bringing they should also be unbiased in their teachings when it comes to homosexuality religion or race that way a child will see all the aspects of life and have a better understanding.and more tolerance.

I agree with you and applaud you for your beliefs.

The Catholic Church and any other agency is being paid to render a service. The Church is just another entity that should be required to follow the same regulations as any other entity.

If they don't believe in a cause then they shouldn't adopt it or support it. Whose to say that they won't discriminate against straight Jewish parents because they aren't Catholic? Or against a little person because they are too short.

The Church is too big for it's britches and needs to be taken down a notch. If they want to accept funds for childcare services then they need to abide by the rules governing it. Otherwise they don't have to take the funds.

Blair is correct in making this decision. The Church has always been a huge bully and thinks that it can do what it wants because of who they are. Let's think about this. They did what they wanted with the priests who molest children and where did that get them?

The Church has a long way to go. They are no longer in touch with what their people want or who they are. That's the burden they have to carrry.

speaking as a heterosexual adoptive parent,who has undertaken extensive training and been investigated beyond belief. before been allowed to adopt, i can honestly say there is absolutely NO reason why homosexuals weather in a relationship or not should be prevented from been allowed to adopt and offer a loving home to a child, i must ask do people really still take notice as one the oldest most oppressive organisation in history, the catholic church,surely we have developed more than that as a society

I agree with you that homosexuality is not wrong. It is also not a choice, but has been shown to be a natural state for a persons brain to develop when certain conditions are met when in the womb.

Discriminating against someone on the grounds of their sexual orientation is morally bankrupt. It is the same as discriminating against someone because they are from Swindon! Completely stupid and pointless.

However, I don't think you have your starting point the right way around... Tony Blair didn't 'overrule' the catholic church. He simply re-stated the law. The catholic church used it's adoption service (and clearly the children themselves) as a weapon when wanting to discriminate against gay people. They were, in effect, saying if you don't let us continue to discriminate in whatever way we chose against a serious percentage of the population, we will give up our adoption agency, and dump hundreds of children onto the street. How very christian.

So much for living the life of a christ. God of love?? Pull the other one!

But then the history of the catholic church - both ancient and modern - is not exactly in accord with the whole 'God of Love/Sacred Heart' mythology either.